• Hello Guest, welcome to the initial stages of our new platform!
    You can find some additional information about where we are in the process of migrating the board and setting up our new software here

    Thank you for being a part of our community!

Going from B cam to M cam

2

240-FAN

New member
Joined
Aug 15, 2018
Few years ago I had installed a B cam and Dale?s gear at +4 degrees on my B230F 244.
Planning on installing the stock M cam and the standard cam gear back on.

Any tips/advise to do this without having to do the entire timing belt job?
My thought was:
1. Get the cooling shroud and cooling fan off
2. Line up the marks
3. Use the handy dandy crank holding tool - get the cam gear off while having the belt and cam gear zip tied to keep them lined up
4. Here?s a messy portion now:
A. Swap out the cams - but how do I know where the TDC/0 degrees is?
Would it mean that I put back the M cam and the Dale?s gear - independently move the cam shaft and gear to 0 degree and then simply swap in the stock gear?
B. Once step A above is done, put the belt back and I?m good to go?


Thanks much!
 
It would probably be easier to just remove the timing belt. Especially if you are also replacing the timing gear. I have pulled off one cam swap where I put a clamp on the belt just below the cam gear to hold it all in place and timed right. Although that was just the cam and not the gear.

The little roll pin in the cam will let you know where TDC is on the cam. Also just turn the motor to TDC before disassembly.
 
Thanks for the response. I’m not doing a timing belt job because everything related to timing is 2 years old with about 7-8k miles.

Just wanting to do a camshaft and gear change back to stock as I’m considering selling the car.
The dowel pin suggestion is a good one - it needs to line up with the “slant” of the engine, correct? And at TDC, the first lobe (from front of car) will also be pointing with the slant of the engine?
 
There should be a marking on the back half of the plastic timing belt cover right behind the cam gear.

Even if you re-use the timing belt it is an easier time just to take the whole thing apart if you are replacing the gear.
 
Fair enough. I’m starting to tear the front end apart. While I’m at it, might as well replace the head gasket which has an external oil leak.

I was surprisingly able to break free all the exhaust manifold nuts.
I needed advise on:
1. Do I get the Mahle or Elring head gasket set off RockAuto? Any preference between either?
2. Also any thoughts on whether I need to replace the head bolts? If so, RockAuto has many choices as well? Any preference here between Elring, Victor Reinz or Mahle?
 
240-FAN said:
Fair enough. I?m starting to tear the front end apart. While I?m at it, might as well replace the head gasket which has an external oil leak.

I was surprisingly able to break free all the exhaust manifold nuts.
I needed advise on:
1. Do I get the Mahle or Elring head gasket set off RockAuto? Any preference between either?
2. Also any thoughts on whether I need to replace the head bolts? If so, RockAuto has many choices as well? Any preference here between Elring, Victor Reinz or Mahle?
Click to expand...

Stepping into opinion territory here...
If it was my car I'd go Elring and re-use the bolts.
 
Thank you. I’ll get the Elring set off RA. Any reason to re-use the head bolts? Sorry this is my first big engine project.

I also took pictures of the exhaust side of the engine with the manifold off.
Cylinder 1 has some oil in it.
IMG%5D


The other cylinder ports (?) are dry but covered in black exhaust which I assume is normal?
Will changing the head gasket fix the leak into the exhaust manifold? Or is this a bigger project than a head gasket change?
This is cyl 2
1WSivg7.jpg


This is cyl 3 - what’s the white scoring? Exhaust valve burning out? Or is that a coolant leak? Coolant level hasn’t dropped in 2 years which is when I did the last timing belt job.
m541E8W.jpg


This is cyl 4 - it’s sootier than cyl 2 and 3
pUp0dIm.jpg
 
Last edited:
240-FAN said:
Thank you. I?ll get the Elring set off RA. Any reason to re-use the head bolts? Sorry this is my first big engine project.

I also took pictures of the exhaust side of the engine with the manifold off.
Cylinder 1 has some oil in it.
IMG%5D


The other cylinder ports (?) are dry but covered in black exhaust which I assume is normal?
Will changing the head gasket fix the leak into the exhaust manifold? Or is this a bigger project than a head gasket change?
This is cyl 2
1WSivg7.jpg


This is cyl 3 - what?s the white scoring? Exhaust valve burning out? Or is that a coolant leak? Coolant level hasn?t dropped in 2 years which is when I did the last timing belt job.
m541E8W.jpg


This is cyl 4 - it?s sootier than cyl 2 and 3
pUp0dIm.jpg
Click to expand...

IMGUR is blocked at my work, so can't opine on the pics.
But...
As far as head bolts, by the book, the head bolts are to be replaced on B230s every time the head comes off.
I have done it both ways, replacing and not, and am not convinced that it actually matters.
A quick kiss with the wire wheel and a squirt of clean engine oil on the old bolts while you put it back together is how I would do it on my engine.
 
Thanks. I’ll purchase the Mahle bolts just in case. If the head bolts come out fine, I’ll re-use them.

Any one else have thoughts on the oil leak in cylinder 1 and the white residue in cylinder 3?
I guess, is this car worth fixing? Or does this make for a great deal on local Craigslist?
 
Looks like a little bit of blowby on cyl1. Could be rings, but probably the valve stem seal. You should install new valve stem seals with the head off anyway. Only the intake valves have seals.

Elring gaskets and seals are the way to go. You can get a 'head set' from Elring that includes the HG, intake/exhaust gaskets, valve stem seals, hushers. It may come with a water pump gasket, but I can't remember.

Anytime I do a HG on these cars, i replace the water pump as well. I also replace the front main and layshaft seals.

You should have the head pressure checked and surfaced. If you want to bump compression, you can mill it a shade.

Lastly, I also always just go to head studs. I've never had a HG failure after installing studs. if you are selling the car, that may be overkill.

Chris
 
Last I checked an elring head gasket kit is around $50-60. New front seals would be another $20. Head bolts are $30 a set.

All said and done I would be surprised if it costs more than $200 counting in some machine shop time for resurfacing the head.
 
I'm pretty sure I read that the factory head bolts are non-stretch bolts. Stretch Bolts need to be replaced every time but because these are not stretch bolts, reusing them is fine. Could be wrong about that, but I reused mine based on that info and it turned out fine.
 
I’m most likely going to sell the car because I got my hands on a single owner 940 and I can’t really justify having 2 bricks (not to mention the apt folks here won’t let me have more than 1 car anyways...)
What are the odds that I’ll be able to get away with simply replacing the gasket? I’m asking because if I have to take the head somewhere to get it surfaced/milled, I’m screwed because none of the local shops around here had any interest in doing it when I called them up. The HG leak isn’t bad at all. It’s just a mild external oil seep and I would rather not create a bigger set of problems than what I already have.

Water pump and front seals are new from 2 years ago along with rest of the timing belt stuff (about 7k miles).
 
240-FAN said:
I?m most likely going to sell the car because I got my hands on a single owner 940 and I can?t really justify having 2 bricks (not to mention the apt folks here won?t let me have more than 1 car anyways...)
What are the odds that I?ll be able to get away with simply replacing the gasket? I?m asking because if I have to take the head somewhere to get it surfaced/milled, I?m screwed because none of the local shops around here had any interest in doing it when I called them up. The HG leak isn?t bad at all. It?s just a mild external oil seep and I would rather not create a bigger set of problems than what I already have.

Water pump and front seals are new from 2 years ago along with rest of the timing belt stuff (about 7k miles).
Click to expand...

I think the odds are pretty good.
If I were you, I would get a box of fresh razor blades, and clean up the head and block as best I could and send it. Change blades frequently. Might even consider using Permatex Copper Coat on the new HG also.
 
kyote said:
I think the odds are pretty good.
If I were you, I would get a box of fresh razor blades, and clean up the head and block as best I could and send it. Change blades frequently. Might even consider using Permatex Copper Coat on the new HG also.
Click to expand...

Got it. That?s a little re-assuring to hear. Will using razor blades and brake cleaner do the trick?
Also, for the head bolts torquing, do I need an angle meter to measure the 90 degrees turn or can I eye ball it as closely as possible?

Also, for the copper permatex, would that be on both sides of the gasket?

Thanks everyone for chipping in!
 
Yes, 90 degrees angle torque can be eyeballed. It would be a quarter turn. Use the copper spray on both sides of the head gasket. I like to clean the block using small abrasive discs. They are made for brake discs but work well on the block. But do not use them on the head. That is good with the scraper and cleaning spray.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top