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Old 01-28-2021, 06:53 PM   #1
tog244
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Default h cam 244 not starting

b230f 1987 244 and i just swapped the M cam for an H cam yesterday. everything went well, two of the 10 studs holding the valve cover sheared but in waiting for those parts i put some rtv black gasket stuff around so i could start it and drive it a little without losing too much oil. this worked fine, lost a little bit of oil- no big deal. later that night i went to start the car and it started and drove down to the end of my driveway and then died. now it was pretty cold last night but im not sure if thats the only reason why it wouldnt start. it would crank and try its best to start but i got nothing. i have half a tank of gas, battery was not dead, spark plugs and cables were replaced recently but still it wont start. its currently 33 degrees F which normally my car would start with the M cam in. Im aware the H cam makes it harder to cold start but is that the only reason? i just need some sort of advice
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Old 01-29-2021, 12:21 AM   #2
Jussi Alanko
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I don't think its the camshaft which causes that, unless belt has skip the tooth.
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Old 01-29-2021, 02:15 AM   #3
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ill check my belt again. its just the notch at the top of the cam gear and the bottom pully that i have to line up correct?
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Old 01-29-2021, 03:41 AM   #4
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To see if it's a timing related issue put the crank pulley at tdc, Remove the oil filler cap and look at the front two cam lobes to see if they are in the compression stroke. that means both lobes pointing slighty upwards like this "V" If the lobes are both pointing slightly down like this "^" it's in the exhaust stroke and the crank has to be turned another 360*. Then it's time to check the ignition. Remove the ignition cap, rotor & the platic cover thingy below the rotor. Underneath the cover thingy is a mark. Put back the rotor without the cover and see if it points towards the mark. If that's all good keep it at tdc and remove the upper timing cover and check if the cam gear is lined up with it's mark.
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Old 01-29-2021, 10:31 AM   #5
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when i replaced the timing belt i made sure the cam was in the same position as the one i took out and then i lined it back up with the tdc mark on the cam gear. i would be surprised if thats the case because i remember the two front lobes pointing up. with the distributor i only took the spark plug wires out of the side of the head and i taped the number of the cylinder each wire went to beforehand so is there any way that the distributor timing would be off? the strange thing of it all is that the car ran and drove with no issues for a good bit and then later it ran for a little and then died so i feel like it couldnt be timing if it already ran without me changing anything right?
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Old 01-29-2021, 11:29 AM   #6
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The gear that drives the distributor and oil pomp could easily be off.. Just a 10 minute job in checking it all out, I suggest you start there.
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Old 01-29-2021, 11:59 AM   #7
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so i double checked the timing belt and made sure it was aligned, both marks line up however the cylinder 1 cam lobes are pointed down when at tdc. should i loosen the belt, take it off of the cam gear, turn the crank pully 360 degrees, and put the belt back on? i am trying to be outside working on it as little as possible because its a nice 24 degrees out today.
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Old 01-29-2021, 01:28 PM   #8
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update: the small pin that connected the cam to the cam gear had wiggled out of place so the cam just wasnt turning with the gear. i fixed that and put everything back besides the timing belt cover (made sure the two notches were aligned), charged the battery up, turned the key, and still got nothing. i can see that cam moves when i hand crank the engine over so that is no longer an issue and the cam lobes are pointed up in a wide V at tdc. is there something i should try after hand cranking the engine a bunch and cranking it without it starting a lot of times?
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Old 01-29-2021, 01:37 PM   #9
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If that pin was out and you were cranking it over, probably munched some valves. Time for a compression check. If compression check is good then check for fuel and spark. If all 3 are good then likely a timing issue.
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Old 01-29-2021, 01:46 PM   #10
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how do i go about doing a compression check
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Old 01-29-2021, 02:09 PM   #11
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It's unlikely you had valve interference unless the head has been significantly cut. Most likely the timing is off. Does it seem like it's making compression? Double check the auxiliary shaft/ distributor timing too.
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Old 01-29-2021, 03:14 PM   #12
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i got a compression tester because it is free to return for full money back at autozone so im just going to test to be safe.
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Old 01-29-2021, 03:59 PM   #13
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well all four cylinders did the same thing. there was a little button on the side of the gauge so when i held that down it gave me different results than not holding it down. i cant remember which is which but the two numbers i got for all four cylinders is 120 psi and about 90 psi. both times it shot up to that but did not stay at all, it just shot up to the number then immediately back down... does this mean my valves are toast?
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Old 01-29-2021, 04:09 PM   #14
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Need to youtube compression testing.
That button is a pressure release, crank and the highest number is your compression.
Then press button to relieve pressure.
Make sure all 4 plugs are out when testing, some swear WOT Is needed but it's never been an issue for me.
Do a test dry, then squirt some oil in each hole 1 by 1 and repeat.
If numbers come up, worn rings. If not, valve trouble.
That said...
I don't think you have timing correct.
Use a bic pen or straw to verify TDC.
Make sure cam is aligned, crank is aligned, and distributor is aligned and pointing to the line under the cap.
Then roll the motor over a couple times and recheck.
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File Type: jpg Picture 2.jpg (19.4 KB, 113 views)
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Old 01-29-2021, 04:12 PM   #15
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i knew about the cam and crank timing things but not the third one, ill check that and the distributor. should i check that all of those things are correct and try to start the engine?
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Old 01-29-2021, 04:44 PM   #16
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how should i go about aligning that intermediate shaft mark? theres a seperate cover over it and i dont know how to get it off with such little room around it
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Old 01-29-2021, 05:15 PM   #17
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Carefully...
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Old 01-29-2021, 05:21 PM   #18
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It's really easy to get any of the pulleys off by 1 tooth and get a no start or extremely poor running
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Old 01-29-2021, 07:47 PM   #19
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yeah, if you didn't know about the intermediate pulley that is very likely your issue. flashlight and long flathead > I touch the timing mark on the pulley and then slide over to touch the mark on the cover. If it's a straight line then they are good, if not then adjust a tooth and retry. That method always seems to work for me with that cover still on and looking down into there to line things up.
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Old 01-29-2021, 08:53 PM   #20
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Or just pull the dist and reset it. The mark doesn't really matter.
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Old 01-30-2021, 11:09 AM   #21
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Or just pull the dist and reset it. The mark doesn't really matter.
The mark on the intermediate shaft doesn't matter, to clarify, the mark on the distributor DOES matter.
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Old 01-30-2021, 01:18 PM   #22
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The mark on the intermediate shaft doesn't matter, to clarify, the mark on the distributor DOES matter.
Also there isn't a complimentary amount of teeth on the distributor drive gear as the shaft pulley so if the pulley is off a tooth or 2 you can have the distributor set at the correct spot but it won't leave you any room on the adjustment slot. This won't matter for lh2.4 and up though.
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Old 01-30-2021, 01:53 PM   #23
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Your compression can check OK on a gauge even if your cam timing is off by some teeth.

Pull the upper cover. Then use the crank SPROCKET, not the crank pulley, to set the crank timing.

As long as your dist isn't seized in the block, you can pull it out and re-time it. It takes some practice because it will spin as it goes in. You will need to compensate and start with the shaft/rotor twisted a bit BEFORE the desired position.

To tension the belt, you always want the slack on the tensioner side of the belt. A large clip can help hold the belt onto the cam gear. The large black metal paper clips with arms are good for holding the belt onto the gear.

Set the timing and then I tension the belt with a smack on the tensioner from a hammer and an extension or a screwdriver.
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Old 01-30-2021, 02:17 PM   #24
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SPROCKET or pulley, tomato- tomato when it comes to timing belts.
McMaster-Carr Page:
https://www.mcmaster.com/Timing-Belt-Sprockets
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Old 01-30-2021, 09:32 PM   #25
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i will try all of this as soon as i can, im fairly certain thats at least part of my problem, unfortunately we are expecting a lot of snow tonight so who knows when ill get to work on it
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