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235mm clutch issue

Tfrasca

Active member
Joined
Apr 20, 2015
Location
Ben Lomond, CA
I just put a Yoshi billet flywheel and 235mm Clutch Masters clutch/pressure plate in my car. The engagement point is RIGHT at the floor. If I tighten the cable to move that engagement point off the floor, it ends up putting a bunch of preload on the fork when the clutch is at rest (instead of having a bit of free play so the TOB isn't constantly riding on the clutch fork). It's like my clutch pedal doesn't have enough travel for the clutch.

240 fork, bell housing, and I think it's a 240 TOB. Either way, all of this worked perfectly with my stock flat flywheel and the Yoshi "stage 2" Clutch Masters stuff.

The only thing I did differently is space the fork pivot out about 3/16", so the fork wouldn't hit the bell housing when the pedal was pressed down. I can't see how that would affect the travel needed at the cable end of the fork.

Any thoughts?
 
You don't have to use spacers between pressure plate and flywheel? Some setups do.
 
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You don't to use spacers between pressure plate and flywheel? Some setups do.

You're not supposed to with this setup, I don't think. And spacers between pressure plate and flywheel are for getting the PP springs to be flat. These are flat with no spacers.

I'm thinking this must have something to do with the pivot ball spacing I did. I was just trying to make sure the fork didn't hit the housing, but I think it affected the fork geometry.

Does anyone know if my issue sounds typical to an incorrectly spaced pivot?
 
Hi 142 saver
Do a short drawing and you will understand your prob. I'm to lazy to post pics on this forum.
You need a different, higher, release bearing or you have to modify the fork. I don't remember the style of a 240 fork very precise early at sunday morning ;-)
the point where the release bearing has contact to the fork has to be closed.

good luck, Kay
 
Hi 142 saver
Do a short drawing and you will understand your prob. I'm to lazy to post pics on this forum.
You need a different, higher, release bearing or you have to modify the fork. I don't remember the style of a 240 fork very precise early at sunday morning ;-)
the point where the release bearing has contact to the fork has to be closed.

good luck, Kay

No matter how many pictures I draw, I can't see how a longer throwout bearing is different than spacing the pivot out. Both of those options move the cable end of the fork toward the back of the car, but do either change how much throw the pressure plate needs? That's my problem - this clutch needs more throw than my pedal can give.
 
Yes. We're talking fulcrums here.

Spacing will change actuation because the springs don't function linearly with pressure. I ran into this issue (kind of) with the JVAB and the Kennedy Stage 2. The stack heights are so weird that you really need to mess with it. I went through a whole thread discussing it.

Is your clutch brand new? With mine, after the break in period, it ended up with a better engagement.
 
Yes. We're talking fulcrums here.

Spacing will change actuation because the springs don't function linearly with pressure. I ran into this issue (kind of) with the JVAB and the Kennedy Stage 2. The stack heights are so weird that you really need to mess with it. I went through a whole thread discussing it.

Is your clutch brand new? With mine, after the break in period, it ended up with a better engagement.

Clutch is brand new, yes. But basically undriveable as-is. The fingers of this new pressure plate are almost perfectly parallel to the flywheel once its bolted down. The old pressure plate fingers were sticking out at maybe 15-20 degrees. I always thought they should be parallel, but obviously that's not working for me.
 
With a throwout bearing mounted higher in the throwout bearing arm. Then it would contact the fingers sooner. If you raise the pivot point sure that is some but putting the bearing itself closer to where it operates as well as what you did with the pivot should help this work for you. I've also thought about cutting the pedal and repositioning it so it sits at a higher point inside the car.

Also make sure the throwout bearing arm isn't bent.
 
With a throwout bearing mounted higher in the throwout bearing arm. Then it would contact the fingers sooner. If you raise the pivot point sure that is some but putting the bearing itself closer to where it operates as well as what you did with the pivot should help this work for you. I've also thought about cutting the pedal and repositioning it so it sits at a higher point inside the car.

Also make sure the throwout bearing arm isn't bent.

So I pulled the trans again and started experimenting with shims on the pivot. I put a clutch alignment tool with a long extension attached to it into the clutch so I could spin it with my hand through the shifter hole in the floor. I noted at what point in the pedal travel the clutch disc stopped spinning, and then tried the process with several different shim stacks. Counterintuitively, the only way I could get the engagement point more than 1/4" off the floor was to go back to no shims. So I put the trans back in and rigged up a cable spacer to get me back to an adjustable range. It's slightly better than it was, but I ended up cutting the carpet and moving my seat forward one click.

I'd say it's at the very end of acceptable, but as the disc breaks-in/wears, the engagement point should come off the floor more and more.

And today, I will do a shakedown run by driving it from Santa Cruz to LA. :omg:
 
One thing you made me think of is the two different kinds of clutch release bearing arms. Maybe one mounts the throwout bearing higher and would give you a higher pedal?
The reason I mention this is that I never had a low pedal on my earlier two forties that use the pins to hold the release bearing. But the newer throwout bearing arm that the release bearing just fits into the hole has a much lower pedal in my 93 wagon.

I am comparing my 82 turbo to the 93 wagon in my sig. I'm not sure but possibly one of these arms may work better for you. The other thing that happens is these arms do bend. I've seen pictures here where they reinforced the release bearing arm.
 
I had to use a spaced out TOB that Josh sells with mine, but I use a Ford bearing retainer. At either rate, you will need to change the fulcrum of your fork. No way around it.
 
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